Addictions and community services worker, Jeremy Shulman

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. [00:00:12] Speaker B: Hey there, it's Rob Daniels with you again, bringing you another episode of Awareness. This is episode number five of Awareness fostering a more compassionate, empathetic, and accepting society. Thank you so much for all the love on social media for this podcast thus far, and you can access it wherever you get your podcasts and click, like, subscribe. That would certainly mean a lot to help try and grow the message of this podcast and. And get it out there to as many people out there that need it. So I'm here with episode number five with a very special guest by the name of Jeremy Shulman. And I've. We go way back myself, and. And this. Jeremy and I actually went to elementary school together, and he caught wind of this podcast and meaningful conversations, and he's like, you know what? I got to get on there and chat mental health because it's super passionate subject to him, and it is to me, and that's what I want on this show is to have people that are super passionate about mental health and getting more conversations into the open about it. So, yeah, just Jeremy Shulman here today. He is an addictions and community services worker, and he completed his studies at CDI College. So officially, welcome to the podcast, Jeremy. [00:01:39] Speaker A: Hi, guys. How you doing? [00:01:40] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, good to. Good to have you here. And you know what's really neat about Jeremy is that, like, we essentially have known each other since, like, grade three, I want to say. What is it? Grade two? Grade three. [00:01:53] Speaker A: Grade two. Grade three. I came to Charlton in about grade two. Yeah. [00:01:57] Speaker B: Yeah. And, yeah, I remember the days of. Of playing Red A. You know that with the tennis ball off the wall, foot hockey in the school. Elementary school yard. And, you know, we. We lost touch, but we caught. We caught up once again to. To try and bring you this episode. And, And. And we're here today with a lot of passion. So specifically, what do you think it is that. That made you reach out to me and say, you know what? Hey, I got to do an episode with my old friend. [00:02:28] Speaker A: Just finding somebody that was, you know, that I connected with years ago that was passionate about mental health, the same that I was passionate about, you know, getting the message out to as many people and helping as many people as I possibly can is something I'm passionate about. And when I saw somebody that I knew doing a podcast, you know, I had to be a part of it because it's. It's something very passionate. And, yeah, I feel that the message needs to be reached. [00:02:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Because you are an official mental health voice in Canada with Your certifications. There are a lot of mental health jobs and roles out there, as I imagine you might know if you're watching this at home or listening to it wherever you get your podcast. But I want to know from you, Jeremy, like, why specifically did you choose to work in the line of addictions and community services? [00:03:20] Speaker A: Because I myself suffered from addiction and mental health aspects and I felt that once I was able to recover, my story could inspire somebody, my story might help somebody, I can relate to somebody and maybe do something differently than what's been doing that then what's been done in mental health and you know, hopefully connect to somebody through my own personal experiences. [00:03:47] Speaker B: What exactly, struggles, what exactly were you addicted to that you want to feel comfortable? [00:03:55] Speaker A: Cocaine. I, I, I used cocaine to kind of numb my feelings of depression and anxiety because I didn't want to feel upset, I didn't want to feel useless, I didn't want to feel down. So I found that the cocaine gave me a sense of accomplishment, it gave me a sense of pleasure, and I was able to, to, you know, function in society without having to deal with, you know, being clinically depressed, having anxiety, not being able to put myself in social situations. It gave me confidence to be able to do that. But underlining it wasn't fixing my problem because I wasn't addressing why I was depressed, why I was anxious. I was just covering it up with the, with the narcotics. [00:04:38] Speaker B: Like a band aid. [00:04:40] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:04:41] Speaker B: And how did you overcome this addiction, would you say? Or have you not? [00:04:49] Speaker A: I, I, I, I've, when you're an addict, you're an addict for your life. I mean, it's, it's, you're always going to be an addict and you're always gonna have to try to come overcome your addiction. But for me, the, the big kicker was, was the birth of my daughter. You know, I didn't want to be constantly high and inebriated when my daughter was born. So when my ex wife got pregnant, I said to myself, okay, I've got nine months to, to get off these drugs. And I, I did the best I could and I was able to get off the drugs, but I still didn't really deal with my mental health at that. At that time I was kind of what they call white knuckling it where I wasn't practicing a program and I was just staying sober and, and not, you know, going to 12 step programs and going to meetings and talking about my addiction and, and dealing with the feelings of the underlying cause of why I was addicted. And I didn't do that until my daughter was about four years old when I finally had a mental breakdown and realized that I have to go talk to somebody. And I ended up at South Lake Hospital where I did an outpatient mental health program. And, you know, that, that saved my life. I realized, you know, I have depression, I realized that I have anxiety. And I have to take time to, to breathe, to, to relax, to not let the, the stressors, you know, overtake my emotions. And after I completed that, I knew I wanted to go into this field. And it took me several years after I did that to, to finally get into the field, but. [00:06:25] Speaker B: And to realize that you wanted to turn your pain into purpose. [00:06:29] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:06:29] Speaker B: And I mean, so with it being that you've had this addiction and I've spoken to other addicts in the past, that's. That have said that same message that you never, like, once you're an addict, you're, you're always an addict. It's hard to. I guess it's the same thing as an alcoholic. Like, you get triggered by stuff, but you, you can, you can manage it more efficiently. Would you say now like where you're, where you're. [00:06:57] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:06:58] Speaker B: I mean, not taking it as often or. [00:07:01] Speaker A: Well, I mean, I'm at the point now where I practice more of a thing called harm reduction. I mean, I'm absent for the most part. If I'm at a party, I'm able to drink, I'm able to partake in drugs every now and again. But I've always made a vow to myself that if I'm feeling anything other than happy, I should not pick up a substance because I'm picking up that substance to numb the pain rather than just have fun. And if I'm trying to numb the pain, I'm gonna overuse, I'm gonna over drink, I'm gonna over, you know, step my bounds with drugs because I'm not a hundred percent. So it's very important that if you are going to practice harm reduction to realize that you cannot do drugs, do alcohol if you're feeling depressed because you're gonna numb the pain. And your chances of overdoing it and slipping right back into your addiction are know. Almost 100%. [00:07:59] Speaker B: Yeah. Wow, it's you. You sound like you've certainly gone through a lot. And I'm, I'm, I'm grateful for you as a friend that you got that wonderful experience from South Lake. Do you want to elaborate more on. On some of the therapies that they went through to, to help you with. [00:08:18] Speaker A: The addictions, a lot of it was, you know, cognitive behavioral therapy. You know, 12 step meetings, being able to, to reach out to people when you're feeling low, not feeling afraid. They also, you know, taught you how, you know, mindfulness to, to be able to relax your body, to, you know, take the time, count 10 seconds, go for a walk, let the, let the feeling pass rather than act on the emotion right away. Um, you know, the cognitive behavioral therapy really, really helped because through cognitive behavioral therapy, you're able to change your thought processes and you're able to differentiate. Okay, normally I would do this, but that's a negative reaction and I'm going to get upset because of it. So maybe I should try this instead. [00:09:09] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:09] Speaker A: And that's where the cognitive behavioral therapy helped. So I was able to make different decisions. [00:09:15] Speaker B: Was this one on one therapy or sort of like a, like an Alcoholics Anonymous type of approach where there's a group of people. [00:09:25] Speaker A: It was a group of people. And there was also one on one counseling. So it was kind of a combination of both, which, which is prevalent, I think, even for, you know, for addiction and mental health. People benefit from group therapy as well as, as individual therapy. [00:09:40] Speaker B: And how long was the treatment? [00:09:41] Speaker A: I went through treatment for eight weeks and I had the option to stay longer. I actually ended up staying two extra weeks because I just felt like I needed some extra time before I was able to go back out. [00:09:55] Speaker B: Something like this covered by OHIP or. [00:09:59] Speaker A: Some certain, certain things. The treatment, the treatment center that I went to was covered by ohip, but it was an outpatient one. Some, some treatment centers can be covered by ohip, but a lot of the, A lot of the treatment centers for mental health and addiction, unfortunately, are private and people are unable to, to afford the treatment that they need. [00:10:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:21] Speaker A: And if they, you know, and if they do get the treatment that they need, they're put on a waiting list. [00:10:26] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:26] Speaker A: And sometimes that waiting list takes too long and it's too late for that person. [00:10:30] Speaker B: Yeah. And you actually might have a solution to this, which we will get to a little later on in the podcast. But first I wanted to talk to a little bit about addiction and beyond, let's say, pills. There's all kinds of addictions that are out there. And you being an addictions and community services worker, one of the new ones, I would say, within at least the last 10, 15 years. And what I find myself catching, catching myself every now and then because of being a content creator is the addiction to social media, and it's negatively influencing Several audiences out there. I mean, listen, there's positives and negatives to everything. Social media is. Is one of those as well. And have you worked with someone that had. That has had a negative impact with social media on them? And, and how did you work with that individual? [00:11:33] Speaker A: Yeah, I have. It's a social media addiction is. It's a process addiction. So it's similar to a gambling addiction where you would get dopamine from the actual act and it releases the dopamine in your brain and you get the sense of feeling of being high or of being drunk. And it's the same looking at social media. People tend to want to escape their lives, and it's easy to escape your life and scroll on social media and see funny me funny memes. And it's, it's limiting that. Right. So if, if you're working through a process addiction, it's finding other ways to get that dopamine that are healthy. [00:12:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:19] Speaker A: It's putting yourself in situations where you are uncomfortable to help with that process. So, like if you're a gambler, go to the racetrack and don't gamble. [00:12:30] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:31] Speaker A: Right. Just sit there and enjoy your time. If you're looking at social media constantly, you know, put your phone down, clean the kitchen, try not to. To look at your phone as much as possible and realize why you're looking at your phone. Are you looking at your phone because you're depressed and you have nothing to do and you want to laugh? That might not be a good idea because you'll scroll and scroll and scroll until you hit that dopamine effect. [00:12:56] Speaker B: Yeah. So what you're saying is that's considered what, cheap dopamine or not the dopamine that you want? [00:13:02] Speaker A: It's not the dopamine that you want because it's not healthy dopamine. [00:13:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:05] Speaker A: It's not dopamine. You're. You're trying to escape. [00:13:08] Speaker B: Escape. Yeah. [00:13:09] Speaker A: And you don't want that dopamine that you get from escaping. You want healthy dopamine that comes naturally. [00:13:15] Speaker B: Yeah. Now, I know we live in a society now where it's like, it's. It's almost impossible to get away from your phone, you know, regularly. What, what is a healthy usage, would you say, of social media on a weekly basis? [00:13:34] Speaker A: 35, 40 minutes a day? [00:13:36] Speaker B: 35, 40. [00:13:37] Speaker A: I mean, you come home from work. [00:13:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:39] Speaker A: Check your social media. You have dinner. [00:13:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:42] Speaker A: You watch a movie, you go to bed. I mean, that's a healthy lifestyle. But there's people out there that, you know, sit on their phones and sit on social media the entire night until they go to sleep. [00:13:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:52] Speaker A: They don't put their phone down. You're not interacting with your family. You're not taking care of yourself because you're just searching for that. [00:13:58] Speaker B: Right. [00:13:59] Speaker A: You know, one little dopamine that you can get. Right. [00:14:02] Speaker B: Yeah. Would you agree, too, that I, I believe that truthfully, that social media is like, it's got to be used as a tool and we're using it more as. Yeah. Like an escape, like you said. Right. Like, for me, as a content creator, I'm on there trying to. I would probably be on. Be one of those people that are further than the 35, 40 minutes a day because of just what I do or try to do for a living. But I, I find my escape is literally not using social media at all one day a week. That's it. But I find it could be different for everybody, which. [00:14:39] Speaker A: Absolutely. I mean, there's, there's, there's different aspects to it. Right. I mean, people in this day and age, we're so connected by social media and our phones. I mean, it's, it's almost impossible to not pick up your phone and not look at an email and then look at the email and then say, oh, I got five minutes. I'm just gonna scroll over on social media. [00:14:59] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:14:59] Speaker A: And it just becomes a process of every time you pick up your phone, I'm gonna check this, I'm gonna check that. Where it's, you know, you have to kind of sit back and say, okay, I'm working. I could check my email. I'll do that later. [00:15:11] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:15:11] Speaker A: I don't have to look at social media right now. But if. You mean, if it's, if it's part of your job. Yeah, it's a little bit different. You have to look at social media, and social media can be used as a tool, like you said. [00:15:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:22] Speaker A: There are some great things out there on social media. Yeah. But it's sifting through all of it and, and, and being careful what you, what you watch and being careful what you use social media for. Because it can lead into a problem. [00:15:35] Speaker B: Exactly. Talk to me a little bit about your past. I mean, when we grew up as kids, and if I, My memory serves me correctly, that's probably the last time we saw one another when we were kids or what do you want to say? Adolescents. I don't know. [00:15:51] Speaker A: Like, we were like high school, probably. [00:15:53] Speaker B: School, elementary school, years old. So we're thinking more like it's been like a good 20 years that we have been that we hadn't seen one another, but we. We keep in touch and on social media and, you know, your past. I. I remember it vividly. Certain scenarios where I think you and I were in detention a lot in elementary school. Do you remember that? [00:16:20] Speaker A: Yeah, I spent a lot of time. [00:16:22] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, especially taking advantage of certain situations when it comes to supply teachers, which, you know, they are incredible humans and incredible what they do. But I know as kids, it's something that we, you know, it. We tested their boundaries a lot. [00:16:39] Speaker A: Oh, yes, we did. [00:16:40] Speaker B: Supply teachers ended up in detention a lot. And. But a lot of this was, you know, our mental health and trying to push buttons. Like I hear that happen in, you know, my daughter's class too. My daughter will tell me that there's, you know, it's out of control when there is a supply teacher. And I guess that trend has continued, you know, whatever it is, 20 years later type of thing. But when it comes to your past, I mean, you've admitted to me that you. You knew you had some mental health challenges ever since you were a kid, and, and while we attended elementary school together. But what specifically were those mental health challenges that you may have learned about years later? And. And do you still battle them today? [00:17:28] Speaker A: Yeah, I, as a kid, I knew something wasn't right in high school. Like, I knew something wasn't right in elementary school and throughout high school, I knew I didn't feel like I was the same as everybody else. I. I always saw people smiling and having fun, and I just. I couldn't. I couldn't do it. So my natural reaction was to act out in school, to. To misbehave. I had attention deficit disorder, so it was very hard for me to concentrate. I had an opposition defiance disorder. So somebody telling me what to do, my first reaction was, I'm gonna do. Doing that for you. Why? Why? Why do I have to prove to you that I know this? Yeah. Which led to a lot of depression because I wasn't able to sit in a regular classroom with. With the regular students. If you. If you remember, I was put in a room called room 102, which was for the special ed kids. And a lot of the time I would be isolated, you know, put in a private little office because I wasn't doing my work, and they didn't know what to do with me. And I would get frustrated and angry, and I just felt that I wasn't a proper person because I saw all of my friends being able to, you know, function in School, being able to sit in regular classrooms, being able to do things that, you know, find joy in, little things that I couldn't find joy in. And I kind of just suffered in silence all throughout elementary school and all throughout high school until I was able to find drugs and alcohol, which kind of numbed that, and I was able to become more social, and I was able to hide those feelings of feeling inadequate from my peers and feeling that I wasn't the same as them. [00:19:13] Speaker B: How did your, like, parents manage that for you as a child? Did you have to take medication for the. [00:19:19] Speaker A: They tried a lot of different medications, and I kind of wish that they didn't. One of the. One of the medications they tried was. Was Ritalin, which. Which is a stimulant. And by the time I was, like, 15, 16, you know, I had. I had stimulants in my system, and I wanted something stronger. And. And that's where I went into cocaine. And I think that a lot of people that are on those drugs, eventually, they look for a stronger stimulant eventually. It's. It's. It's unfortunate, but I think that it can lead to addiction if it's not monitored properly. [00:20:00] Speaker B: So the adhd, does that become a problem nowadays for you? Like, is it. Is that a bigger challenge? Is it still a big challenge still? [00:20:09] Speaker A: It's still a huge challenge. But as. As an adult, I've learned different techniques to help my keep. To help keep myself focused. If I start, you know, losing interest in something, I'll start shaking my leg or I'll start vibrating, or I'll start, you know, counting my head to 10 seconds so I can come back to the moment. [00:20:26] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:27] Speaker A: And. And be focused. It's. It's just finding tricks. I mean, I don't. I don't like the medications. The medications made me feel numb and made me feel, you know, just kind of like a robot. [00:20:39] Speaker B: So you're off of them now? [00:20:40] Speaker A: So I'm off of all medications now. I don't take any medications for my ADHD or. Or my mental health. I don't know. [00:20:46] Speaker B: So when you say you're experiencing some of the symptoms of adhd, though, it's sort of like I've heard this phrase before. Monkey mind. Is that what is going on? Your mind is jumping from different things? [00:20:59] Speaker A: It's just racing. Yeah, it's just racing. [00:21:00] Speaker B: Like, so basically using awareness, the name of the show, to say, okay, I'm getting too far away from the moment. I got to come back to now. [00:21:08] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Clear. Clear your thoughts. You know, focus on one thing a lot of the time. Conscious mind, like, a lot of the time, my adhd. And everything will really pop up when I'm sleeping, like when I try to go to bed and I can't. I can't fall asleep because my mind is just racing with a whole bunch of different things. So to calm myself down, I'll pick one thing in my mind and I'll start. Okay, focus on this, focus on this, focus on this, focus on this. And eventually you start focusing on the one thing and you're able to calm your mind. It takes a lot of practice and a lot of, you know, work to be able to decalm yourself. But I think it's better than the alternative of the stimulants and the drugs and everything like that to rather to deal with it. [00:21:52] Speaker B: Do you find for yourself? I can't remember if one of my other guests told me this, that it doesn't work for them. I think so. Meditation for an ADHD mind. [00:22:04] Speaker A: Yes and no. Yes, some. Sometimes it can work, sometimes it can. It all depends on how anxious I am, what's going on. I definitely try to meditate at least once a day. [00:22:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:20] Speaker A: Even if it's for five minutes, because it does help calm you down. It doesn't stop it. No, but it helps. Exactly. And manages it. [00:22:29] Speaker B: So for yourself, I wanted to know what kinds of addictions that you're hearing about as a addictions and community services worker. What kinds of addictions are you hearing about most as you navigate the mental. [00:22:46] Speaker A: Health spectrum right now? A lot of alcohol and a lot of fentanyl. Like opiates. Okay. And crystal meth. You know, there's. There's a little bit of cocaine, but there's a huge problem with, with opiates and alcohol right now. I think those are the two main addictions. [00:23:04] Speaker B: So alcohol, can you give me an example of, like, when you, when you have a client come to you with an addiction like that? How do you help someone with that addiction? [00:23:17] Speaker A: I can't help you unless you want the help. Okay. You can come to me because you were court ordered to come here. And if you don't want to work with me, I can't help you. If you're not honest with yourself, I can't help you. So when someone is willing to put in the work, I would. I'm able to help them and, you know, I recommend to them. Okay, let's talk about why you're here. What's the underlying cause of why you picked up the drink? Because A lot of the times there's an underlining cause. A lot of the times you're drinking because you're depressed, you're drinking because of anxiety, you're drinking because, you know you had a bad day, and, and you tend to over drink. And that's when you, you become an addict. So it's getting to the underlying cause of why am I doing this? So once we can get to that underlying cause, okay, you have clinical depression because some so and so died and it made you upset. So now let's deal with that. Let's go through, have you gone through the process of accepting the loss? Have you gone through the process of doing this? A lot of the times people don't. So we'll start going through the process of accepting the loss. And then we start going through cognitive behavioral therapy, which I explained is kind of changing your thought process of putting in new tools to say no to the older things that you would, you would say yes to. You know, and a lot of it, group, group therapy, you know, 12 step programs, as, as hokey as they sound, they work for a reason because they hold you accountable. And that's just, you know, holding yourself accountable and, and, and knowing who you are without the drugs and alcohol is very important. So it's getting to that underlying cause why I picked up. [00:25:05] Speaker B: Yeah. And turning your pain into purpose. [00:25:07] Speaker A: And turning it into purpose, what you. [00:25:09] Speaker B: What you've been doing and, and what you could probably relate to. And I wonder what you tell your clientele in terms of battling the withdrawal symptoms. What goes on in that sense when you're talking to a client and if they tell you they've got really bad withdrawal symptoms. [00:25:27] Speaker A: So before, a lot of times, before a client comes to me, they've gone through the detox process. Okay, so they're not getting the withdrawal symptoms that they would have because they've already gone through a detox process. I have dealt with, with some clients that are in active use. It depends on what they're, what they're taking. I mean, if you're, if you're taking alcohol and you withdraw from alcohol, there's a very good chance that you're going to die. You need alcohol in your system because you could have a seizure and you could die instantly. So if someone comes to me who's drinking and who is continue drinking, you know, I tell them to go to a doctor, I tell them to get on certain medications so that it could help hit the receptors so they're not feeling withdrawal symptoms. They have gabapentin and A lot of times they would take Xanax because it helps hit the same receptors. And the gabapentin helps with the withdrawal and the seizures. And I always tell them, like, listen, once you get through those physical aspects of, of the withdrawal, your mental withdrawal kicks in, and it's battling that mental withdrawal. I mean, I used to use drugs and alcohol, and there's not a day that goes by that I don't think, hey, I want to pick up that bag again. I want to go out and I want to have some fun. But I can't do that because I know it will just lead down to the road and it's constantly there. So it's fighting that temptation with the cognitive behavioral therapy of, okay, this is what I would normally do, but this is what my therapy has taught me to do. What's the better option? Obviously, the better option is to do what your therapy taught you. [00:27:01] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. You've revealed to me recently that you have had some real big dreams of opening up certain mental health facilities to help others. Why don't you elaborate on those dreams to the audience? [00:27:22] Speaker A: Okay. I'm in the process right now of setting up something where people can afford therapy. There's a lot of people out there with mental health and addiction issues that can't reach a counselor, that can't get to a center, you know, for various reasons, costs. They're homeless, you know, they don't have access to a telephone or Internet. So what I want to do is I want to open up an organization where I can get donations from people where I'm able to offer, you know, free to no, you know, little cost therapy for people that can't afford it. Yeah, where I'm able to, you know, go out to the streets and, you know, give food to the homeless, you know, direct them to where they need to go. I want to be able to help the people that can't afford the help that they, that they have. You know, they don't get it. So. [00:28:18] Speaker B: So how do you plan to do this? Like, what types of facilities are we talking about? And, and what would be your plan in regards to operating, though? [00:28:26] Speaker A: To. To begin with, it's going to be a small office, you know, with a handful of volunteers made up of peer support workers. Peer supports are people that have been through mental health and addiction themselves, but necessarily don't have a degree. [00:28:44] Speaker B: Okay. [00:28:44] Speaker A: Their value in helping somebody is absolutely essential because the more you've been through, the, the better you are at helping somebody. You know, as well as I hope to get a Few other addiction counselors and maybe some psychologists on board. And what you'll be able to do is you'll be able to call the phone number, explain your problem and you know, one of, one of our teams, peer support worker, myself or, or somebody else will be able to reach out to you and you know, give you 45 minute sessions a week for about 15. And if you can't afford it, no cost. [00:29:18] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:19] Speaker A: And the donations, and the donations will help. [00:29:22] Speaker B: It would help you guys out. The people, maybe the volunteers, if they need some extra, they need. Everyone's gotta make some kind of money to, to get by. Right. [00:29:30] Speaker A: And so ideally, you know, yeah, we'll draw a small, small salary out of it for myself and for the other workers that are, you know, really putting an effort into it. And the rest of the money, I, you know, I want to donate, I want to, you know, put it into the homeless shelters, put it into places like Yellow Brick House where abused women go, you know, put it into, you know, even, even treatment centers because treatment centers need, you know, funding as well. Places like camh, they're, they're very publicly funded place, you know, so even donating. [00:29:59] Speaker B: It to their pure intentions. You hear that? Pure intentions is what Jeremy Shulman is all about. And he is certainly a valued employee in this province and grateful to have him here again. He's an addictions and community services worker. Is there if people want to like, just reach out to you and they have a question for you. What would be the best way of, of getting in touch? [00:30:28] Speaker A: My email or my phone number? My email is J. Schulman addictions counselormail.com and my phone number is 905-868-0163. [00:30:40] Speaker B: Okay, before I let you go, one last question for you. What else do you, Jeremy Shulman, want the public to, to be aware of as we continue to try and abolish the stigma around mental health? [00:30:59] Speaker A: Be aware of, of, of mental health itself. I, I'm a strong believer that everybody on this planet has had about with mental health themselves, whether they admit it or not, whether they realize that they did or not. Everybody has lost somebody, Everybody has lost a pet. Everybody has gone through something. And yes, you may have been, you know, only for two weeks, but you still suffered from depression. [00:31:30] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:31:31] Speaker A: So what I, what I really want to leave people with is, is, is learning and education. I, I, I really think that we have to start implementing more mental health education than we have. You know, and we can start in the elementary schools. We could start at the beginning. We're learning sex education. We're learning education on addiction and on drugs, but we're not learning education on mental health, which is the underlying cause of all of those problems. [00:32:01] Speaker B: You hit that one right on the nose, 150%. So true. So that that's fantastic. You said a lot. And hopefully it could help others here on this podcast. I am so grateful that you came in. And hopefully we can do this again once you get that big dream turned into reality and can bring more into awareness when, when that comes to fruition. [00:32:25] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:32:26] Speaker B: Thanks so much, Jeremy Shulman. [00:32:27] Speaker A: Thank you. [00:32:28] Speaker B: All right. Amazing. That's awareness, episode number five. Thanks so much for joining us here today. I'm Rob Daniels. Thanks so much to producer Jasper. And we'll see you in the next episode.